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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 6, 2013 9:30pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

As you were eluding to in your post while there are more technically and intellectually talented players such as McLaughlin and the like they leave me cold and I have no desire to listen to their music.One of the similarities I see in Jimi and Garcia is their ability to play and create very melodic music which is a rare talent among guitarists.I also find them both to be strong rhythm players along with their lead responsibilities.

I really enjoy that "drenched" aspect in Jimi's sound that you described as wobbly through the use of pedals and such,it does create a unique sound and feel.I also like the ferocity of his strumming technique,it's singular in style and adds to the overall effect of his playing.

Amongst the many things that maybe didn't allow Jimi to reach his full potential, one I mentioned was his supporting musicians and it wasn't so much how they actually played,but more how he would have been better served with musicians who challenged him mentally rather than guys who played the role he created for them.With his music I find almost everything but his playing and vocals to be unimaginative and mediocre.

I've listened to a fair amount of his live output and agree with you that Woodstock was especially good,he seemed particularly energized and on top of things.

I tend to forget Dave Holland's involvement with Miles and never really put together that he was playing electric bass on some of those tracks,he is one of the finest stand up players I have ever heard and I've seen him countless times play some inspired music.

I had heard that Are You Experienced and listening again enjoyed the variety of styles he runs through in the course of the song,he seems to change his attack every minute or so for the whole 12 minutes.It was impressive how different it was from start to finish.I hadn't heard that Tax Free and I'm not to familiar with the song,but I liked the feed back-ish ringing licks and morse code sounding jam at about 6 minutes in.I also don't think I've heard that version of Cherokee Mist,this one is very trippy with some squealing,siren like sounds that shifts to a therimin-ish section with the sitar that blends into a quiet spacey end jam.The Laughing Sam's Dice song starts out like weird Jimi surf music that segues into some smokin' guitar that continues throughout underneath the vocal,it is some powerful guitar playing with a really cool shuffle towards the end.

I enjoyed this course on Jimi and will continue my under graduate work on You Tube,thanks for sharing some knowledge and time.

My favorite Jimi tune.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM7btrc-hCs

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 7, 2013 12:20am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

We're fortunate to have some Axis outtakes, including this earlier, longer instrumental take of Bold As Love -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rck11HnpReU
(There's also an alternate mix available of the final take w/o lead guitar.)
And also an earlier instrumental Little Wing -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9GSF8agnYc

There's an interesting instrumental club jam on Little Wing you may have seen, with Butterfield's band - it's rare to hear Hendrix jamming one of his earlier songs with others. The best part is the final minute, when Hendrix returns after some dull solos from the others:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByN1oHmRVrU

As a final appendix, this is an extremely different live Are You Experienced - done at Newport '69, one of the Experience's last shows. Hendrix was fed up that day & very upset with the crowd (at one point telling them, "you all just choke yourselves, fuck off" in this exchange: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mhootMxpjE ), and you can hear his disgust in the performance. However - midway through the song, he changes tack & starts playing a quiet passage almost for himself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8u6oiWMFr1I

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 7, 2013 10:56am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Fortunate indeed,I listened to Bold As Love 4 times in a row.The playing between 2:15 and 5:45 is exhilarating,as good as I have ever heard him play.

Listening to Little Wing without the lead part accentuates just how beautiful a melody it is and shows off his rhythm chops.

That exchange with the asshole in the audience is disturbing and like you said it is in audible in his performance,the solo begins in an angry mood with a choked off kind of slashing feel that segues into hard,chugging strumming that flows into at about 4:15 what sounds like some of the Beatles We Can Work It Out which melds into some rapid fire clusters that calms itself into an almost introspective slow jam back into the theme.It is definitely an odd reading of the song.

I wonder if you might recommend some of his better Dylan covers,I've heard a few versions of Like a Rolling Stone and while good they always fell a little short of how good I thought he could do it.I don't know how many Dylan songs he actually covers outside of Watchtower and Drifters Escape,I read somewhere he did Tears of Rage and I believe a while back I saw he did I Dreamed I Saw St. Augustine also somewhere in the back of my head is the possibility he did Please Crawl Out My Window.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 7, 2013 12:33pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Glad you liked the Bold As Love.

I thought Hendrix's cover of Drifter's Escape was rather disappointing. Unfortunately, though he wanted to record St Augustine, he never did, feeling it was too personal.

This Rolling Stone is from an NYC club in '68, not with the Experience but various NY players, including Al Kooper on organ (who'd played on the original) - but no BB King as claimed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEbLv3alp0w
No solo, but a very nice intro; it's one of Hendrix's better versions. (Youtube also has one from Winterland '68 which is done very slowly, with another organ player.)

Please Crawl Out Your Window, from the BBC:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7LSfnpcvwA
(Live versions are pretty poor sound quality.)

Tears of Rage, a home demo with a harmonica player - he never did this one live or in the studio:
http://www1.rollingstone.com/hearitnow/player/jimi.html

Hendrix didn't do All Along the Watchtower live very often.
Here at the Isle of Wight '70 -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKfozyldDr8
Unfortunately this was one of his worst shows, he was out of it & had equipment troubles, so it's not a great version, but illustrates how he did it live.
And at Atlanta '70 -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3KvO16oosM
Ironically, this was also a pretty bad show, and this Watchtower starts terribly, but improves, though still not great. You can see how he didn't improvise with this song, but did it just like the studio version.

As an antidote to those, here's the best live version of Little Wing, from the well-known London '69 show -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chipnEfY16w

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 7, 2013 6:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

That Rolling Stone did have a cool,different intro and was fairly tight for a jam type scenario,strong organ and bass and nicely built lead runs.I had one from the Scene in 69' with Buzzzy Linhart and some other folks that was pretty good as filler on a tape with the Things I Used To Do with Johnny Winter from 68' at the Scene and a few other things.

The Please Crawl was punchy with a nice vocal.

Listening to that Tears of Rage made me think of him doing Goin' to Alcapulco or Ain't No More Cane.I wonder what he thought of the band.His version of Tears was rough but interesting,it also featured him on acoustic which is seems to be a rarity.I really liked his acoustic version of Angel.

He surely wasn't at his best on those Watchtower's,it was humorous that the guy who uploaded the first one on YouTube included this line in his notes "one of the greatest performance live ever" proving himself wrong on a few fronts.In the second one after a clam or two Jimi steps to the mike and says "as I was saying" in hopes of regrouping,but drops in another hack,it just wasn't meant to be.It is disappointing that he does perform them just like the album version.

I've always enjoyed that version of Little Wing,and there is also one I think from the Olympia in Paris on the same tour that I like,but it always seemed to me that such a pretty song deserved a substantial solo after each verse,never mind that he just gave you the mini solo after verse two the way he actually performed it.

I'm going to listen to the Newport Pop Festival from 6/22/69,the first tune Earth vs. Space was pleasantly weird and featured an odd line up of musicians.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 7, 2013 9:12pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

You're probably thinking of Paris 1/29/68, one of the best shows of that period - Hendrix does some extra soloing at the end of that Little Wing. (There's also a version from Winterland which is extended but rather slow & sloppy.) That song was kind of like Wind Cries Mary, it was always kept short & sweet.

I also like the home demo of Angel, and from the same session, 1983:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Wu-aLIAzWo
There was also a less developed demo of Gypsy Eyes very different from how it turned out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrdbur7Eh2c

He did not play on acoustic very often. There are some longer acoustic demos which don't seem to be well-represented on youtube. Of course there's the 12-string Hear My Train, and this Hound Dog which gives a glimpse of Hendrix offstage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5bGUsT0OV8
And in a similar style, this demo of Long Hot Summer Night:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E85-OlOKYk

The search also led me to this short but interesting take 1 of Electric Ladyland, Hendrix solo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfqjhAH6gTc

Hendrix came back to the Newport stage on 6/22/69 feeling that he had to make up for the disastrous 6/20 show; and more than made up for it with the enormous jam where he pretty much runs freestyle through one tune after another with various players (there's flute, sax, harmonica & another singer in there too), and he wails throughout, though Buddy Miles comes to dominate with his yapping. Very loose & unusual for a Hendrix show; there's nice footage of it, too.

As an unrelated tidbit, Hendrix played Dear Mr Fantasy live a couple times in '68, and here is one of them (in poor sound, alas) -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzMxrTf6WiI
Nothing extraordinary, just his neat little tribute to Traffic. I'd much rather hear him do it than the Dead...

This post was modified by light into ashes on 2013-03-08 05:12:14

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 8, 2013 12:58pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

It's funny because those are the two I would have enjoyed being stretched out some.

I would have liked to hear him play acoustic more because I really like the way he sings and think it suits his voice and since his electric style is so in your face the acoustic could have a shown a more delicate side of his playing.

1983 on the acoustic lent a relaxed feel to the song and you can hear him turning a page for the music or lyric in the middle.

I really liked Gypsy Eyes,it had a nice drive or progression that I'm not sure would sound similar on an electric,to bad it cut.

Hound Dog is an odd choice,but he does seem to be enjoying himself.That guy who pipes in about the girl being thirsty sounds like Larry King.

Long Hot Summer night has a Rolling Stone intro,a good vocal and a cool rhythm.

I love Electric Lady Land and would have liked to hear him play it some more in that vein,it had a very jazzy tone and damping style.

Fantasy is definitely a song that is in his wheelhouse and I liked his intro which was ballsy and deliberate,but I didn't like when he sped it up.Seems like he could have worked up a good version of this one.I wouldn't have minded hearing Jerry and the boys in 69' doing a Cosmic Charlie ->Dear Mr. Fantasy,they just got to it to late thats all.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 9, 2013 3:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

I suppose if you want to hear Little Wing stretched out you'll have to turn to Stevie Ray Vaughan...

With Electric Ladyland, a similar guitar line did end up in the album version, it's just buried under all the overdubs!

A few different Hendrix directions, which you've probably heard before -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQfC2isDTbA - New Rising Sun, an Electric Ladyland-type instrumental, very new-agey in style with Hendrix's wobbly sound in full effect.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAoc9EDxYwc - Pali Gap, which is almost more like a Santana track.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAuxg9-yU2g - South Saturn Delta, the Electric Ladyland outtake mentioned way up in this thread; Hendrix's lead playing is in a very different style than usual for him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IERJ9MVl_zM - the so-called "MLK jam," an excerpt from a much longer studio jam; the Band of Gypsies basically keep time while Hendrix flies off Machine Gun-style; at the end he switches to the Cherokee Mist theme but breaks a string, which brings it to a halt.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVJWhzOsq6g - Villanova Junction, from Maui '70, a very nice version; he quiets it down in the second half. Much of the second set of this show is very drifting & spacy like this.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 9, 2013 11:16am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

From the last post I haven't gotten a chance to finish off that Newport Pop Festival,I will get back to it.

Yeah Stevie Ray had the right idea when it came to Little Wing.

That snippet of Electric Ladyland you linked had a pure jazz tone and attack,it might be the same notes,but it doesn't seem to be the same style or sound on the album even buried beneath the overdubs.

The New Rising Sun hints at Little Wing and has a really spacey feel,his guitar sounds like a keyboard at some points.The very end puts me in mind of Sun Ra.

The intro to Pali Gap sounds like a slowed down version of Badge.It's funny to hear him so blatantly play off himself with overdubbed lead lines,that are scorching by the way.At 3:30 he has a good blend of his guitar lines and at 3:45 he takes off on a nice run with a crisp tone and two distinct lead lines weaving together,once again at times his guitar is keyboard-ish.I think the drums supply the Santana feel although Carlos did liberally add pieces of Jimi's style to his playing.

South Saturn Delta I had heard,but never really listened.You have to give him credit for playing some truly psychedelic funk a couple of years before Funkadelic came along.It has a cool trippy soul music open his guitar is very rhythm player oriented,2:15 some spacey,throbbing horns lead into a good honking sax/guitar duet into a hot jam.What a great song,I can't fathom how this didn't make the album.

The MLK jam has some interesting playing and after the intro the music has a sort of dark,relaxed anger to it which switches to outer space music around the 3 minute mark into a scratchy,mellow churn with some high up on the strings by the bridge scratching which devolves into a slow thump kind of rock shuffle.This is a good example where a talented rhythm section might have propelled this jam to a different level,but throughout only provided some limp,straight ahead backing which left the onus on Jimi to make anything interesting happen.

This my favorite Villanova Junction,it has an elegant air and his playing is purposeful and focused,every note counts and there is no over playing.Also to be commended are Mitch and Billy who add the proper backing to this one and towards the end he throws in a flamenco style jam as you had mentioned some posts back.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 10, 2013 10:37am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Thanks for the comments. This'll have to conclude the Hendrix University courses, I'm about done! Youtube is a great resource, but selective; many of my favorite Hendrix things are inexplicably not up. I'd hoped to find the 4/26/69 LA versions of Tax Free & Spanish Castle Magic, the best versions; but that's a well-known show.

Just a couple more things - this is a 1967 demo for Angel, with Hendrix dubbing all the instruments; it has a lighter feel, and the second half is pretty nice:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHjkmN_ePvQ
And this is the last thing Hendrix recorded in the studio in '70, a brief fragment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujyd3EfDOA4

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 10, 2013 3:14pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Well it was a fine course and I got to learn some stuff and hear some interesting music spread out over about 50 links,so my comments were more about letting you know that I listened to the things you took the time and effort to search out and link for me rather than trying to inform you and also maybe let you see that I did get something out of the time you invested.That instrumental Bold As Love and those tunes from the Tinker Street Cinema shows for example,will definitely stay with me and a bunch of other stuff from some other links opened my eyes to different things.So I will keep listening and see what I find,I listened to some of the Isle of Fehmarn show and enjoyed the Voodoo Child and Red House and thought what I heard of the Randalls Island show was disappointing,my friend has been touting that one for years,another clunky Watchtower and weak Message of Love.I downloaded the 4/26/69 L.A. Forum show on your recommendation.

I like the sharper,soaring tone on Angel,but it loses it's delicacy when sped up like that.

That last slow blues fragment is a nice groove and reminded me of this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roHYXrLhmHc

Well from now on I will consider you Professor Emeritus Ashes,thanks.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 10, 2013 5:28pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Oh, that Randalls Island show, while not dreadful, is still subpar I think, with Hendrix in a bad mood & dealing with equipment problems & another unruly audience, telling them to fuck off a few times... The Fehrmarn show is better than might be expected considering the nasty crowd & the generally bad conditions of that tour.
Berkeley 5/30/70 is the best SBD show of the year.

Tax Free & SCM are the highlights of 4/26/69, though I like it all of course; Hendrix does get somewhat defeated by the rowdy crowd towards the end.
Early '69 is probably my favorite live period of his, despite the very limited setlists, since that's when he did the most improvising in the solos. 2/24/69 is also one of the best shows; Hendrix was very focused since the show was being filmed & plays 3 long blues songs, though he does indulge in some weak audience-pleasing at the end.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 10, 2013 10:50pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

I listened to the 4/26/69 show and though I'm not to familiar with Tax Free that version certainly contains some fine playing with some edgy guitar and bass after the intro,but it really takes off at the 8 minute mark with some smokin' quick pickin' runs and pumping bass that trails off into a swirl of feedback that builds to a propulsive end jam of more feedback.
I have been listening to a number of Spanish Castle Magic's lately by the Warren Haynes Band and I know it's not remotely the same thing and hearing this one made it clear why,no one can duplicate that heavy,onslaught of sound that Jimi can generate and that is why I found all the Haynes versions lacking.The 4/26 version is just a beast,after the verse the music is slashing with a big,fat sound and hot runs with strong drums and bass leading into ringing feedback repeat runs that wind into some real hot chunky rhythm lines,at some points it sounds like two guitars and then the pace races with note filled churning leads changing to very jazzy chords to a hard strummed rhythmic pattern,at 7 minutes he reels off a number of styles like a weird flamenco into some Chuck Berry-ish rock into some twisted classical and the band thumps it way back in on the theme and they all stomp their way back into the last verse which segues into the Star Spangled banner where Jimi declares we had been brain washed.Certainly the best version I've heard.
I've got 2/24/69 downloading and I'm looking for a full copy of 5/30/70.I noticed here on the archive there is a 50 odd minute video from Stockholm 1/9/69 that I will give a listen,I've heard some of that over the years,but have no memory of it.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 11, 2013 3:42am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

That's funny, I had never heard the Warren Haynes Band do Spanish Castle...so I checked it out. They're a professional band, I'll say that, smooth & repeatable in what they play - though it doesn't seem to be a tune where Warren particularly shines. Hendrix is very raw in comparison, and puts out much more energy. He was also quite different from show to show, depending on his mood, so you never knew just what he'd do.

The Stockholm video is good quality...though it captures perhaps the weakest show of the Jan '69 tour! Hendrix is notably listless & unhappy in that show. (The Spanish Castle is downright painful, as he loses interest midway through and just gives up on it. He also gives up midway through Voodoo Child and just walks offstage!)
There was a second show on 1/9/69 though (not filmed) where he was in better spirits & it was a distinct improvement - the highlight's probably Voodoo Child, which goes into an unusual section in the middle.
Too bad the film crew wasn't there for the second show, but at least we have a good SBD tape. (Though Noel is too high in the mix in both shows.)
The 5/30/70 Berkeley video is a night & day contrast with the Stockholm video!

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 11, 2013 11:16am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Thanks,I'll steer clear of the Stockholm show and I'm going to watch the Berkeley video.I've watched it before,but just casually.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Mar 11, 2013 12:42pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

Unfortunately the Berkeley footage was cut to shreds for the film, so only a few songs are near-complete and there are lots of jarring edits. (The complete footage apparently no longer survives.)
It's still my favorite Hendrix film, but Monterey and Woodstock are the only good near-complete Hendrix shows to be released. As you've seen there are lengthy clips of 7/30/70 Maui and the Band of Gypsies shows too, and bits of others (like TV appearances). I was dismayed that they released the Isle of Wight '70 horror show, and even more alarmed that they say they're going to re-release the barely better Atlanta Pop '70 show too.

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Poster: jerlouvis Date: Mar 11, 2013 7:37pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Hendrix & horns

I wasn't aware of everything being so chopped up as it has been a while since I watched any Jimi video.I find it really bothersome when music isn't complete in a film,I don't even like when it is interrupted.Thanks for the heads up again.It sounds like that is quite the management team in charge of what product gets released in his name.